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Post by archaxe on Mar 22, 2015 23:46:53 GMT 1
So currently, mages are the only class that cannot equip items with armor rating modifiers (like "Steel", "Onyx", etc). This puts them at a disadvantage loot wise, since every mage item has a substantial risk of spawning with an AR "bonus", thus ruining the item. No other class suffers this penalty, so it exclusively punishes mages. I think this should be changed and this restriction be lifted.
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sinstruck
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Post by sinstruck on Mar 23, 2015 1:51:43 GMT 1
nah i dont think mages should wear ar modifying gear i would get into reason's why not but idgaf to make more of a comment
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Post by casanova on Mar 23, 2015 7:06:15 GMT 1
only mages can boost themselves, and give them extra armor.
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Post by archaxe on Mar 23, 2015 7:42:03 GMT 1
To clarify: the point here is NOT that mages should get more armor but that our items have about 50% chance of being useless due to spawning with an AR modifier. For all I care, you can make the armor bonus not apply to mages if we have the items equipped.
Another solution would be to make items spawning with mage skill modifiers ineligible to also spawn with armor rating modifiers.
A third option would be to add an NPC vendor that can remove properties from items (for a costy fee, perhaps).
Again, the issue here is that mages are the only class who can have their items ruined by (quite common) extra properties.
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Post by casanova on Mar 23, 2015 8:11:30 GMT 1
A third option would be to add an NPC vendor that can remove properties from items (for a costy fee, perhaps). Pretty cool one... |
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Post by allain on Mar 25, 2015 19:49:58 GMT 1
I completly agree i have thrown so many gm amge items away because of armor mods i mean adamatium is 3 ar is it gonna make mages op noway.
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Post by kieeps on Mar 25, 2015 22:31:55 GMT 1
Mages are the only class that can go hunting with a bag of regs and some scrolls, so that trade off is fair. But i do love the idea of an NPC to modify items... That is a cool idea  Or some reverse ritual system  |
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Vex
Full Member
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Post by Vex on Mar 25, 2015 22:36:56 GMT 1
"Ritual of Cleansing" - Sounds like a pretty cool idea, to allow mages to remove armor modifiers from items. I know this isn't a priority as far as scripting is concerned, but I feel like it could be a cool addition, at the cost of some gold, or perhaps medium-high amount of pagans.
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Post by Admin Nagash on Mar 27, 2015 9:50:51 GMT 1
Getting armor modifiers on mage items has been a part of ZH's history since the beginning. I'm not sure if it should be changed. It will make non ar modifier mage items less valuable.
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Post by archaxe on Mar 27, 2015 15:51:10 GMT 1
Thanks for proving my point - mages go hunting with a bag of reagents and some scrolls SIMPLY BECAUSE we can't use gear appropriate for our class, because they all too often spawn with AR modifiers - so we have no gear to use! And when you (rarely) find a usable item, of course you're not going to go hunting with it with risk of losing it. This can be alleviated by making mage items more common (read: less valuable) by, for example, removing this restriction.
Besides, no mage goes hunting naked, unless you're killing skeletons or Rock Dragons.
Not true; everyone can boost themselves using potions or fish. Cf. the discussion on thieves, poisoning, healing, etc. Besides, armor doesn't matter for mages, and the few extra points gained from "Steel" wouldn't do any difference.
Getting DDoS'd has also been part of every ZH shard to date, and that's no longer a problem due to amazing staff and security. This system was flawed and stupid back in 2001, and it still is. Appeal to tradition is a weak argument; you shouldn't preserve something simply because "it's always been like that", you should preserve something because it serves a useful purpose somehow. I fail to see how the current restriction do that.
Changing this would indeed make the non ar modifier mage items less valuable compared to their current value, but not less valuable compared to the ar mod items if you were to change them - because then they would be just as good. The current imbalance between ar mod items and non-ar mod items rests on the latter being over-valued because of rarity.
You could make a similar argument that we should instead IMPOSE this restriction on every other class except warriors, because currently, the non ar modifier crafter/ranger/thief/bard items are just as valuable as the ar modifier crafter/ranger/thief/bard items - which, I understand it, would be a bad thing for mages but is perfectly fine for all other classes?
This perfectly illustrates the (complete lack of) reasoning behind the opposition to lift this restriction.
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Post by ironclad on Mar 27, 2015 16:31:09 GMT 1
Restricting mages from using items with AR modifiers really doesn't add anything except frustration of seeing really good items being reduced to utter crap by 1 prefix. Being able to pay a vendor to remove steel-prefixes from items would be the preferred solution I think, but just making mages able to equip steel items wouldn't be a bad second choice either, to save development time to other matters.
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Post by kieeps on Mar 27, 2015 19:00:37 GMT 1
When i dont have close to as much experience playing mage as you archaxe has i have to trust you here.
I will not rant about my opinion since it's not based on actuall experience.
Allthough the thing with steel mods on items, it seems as if the higher lvl the loot the more likely it is to get one of these steel prefixes...
Is it atleast possible to look over the prefix/suffix generation of loot? maby blacklist the AR prefix on mage classe skillmodifying items, 'Cus i can see how the AR prefix is frustrating when it keeps generatin as often as it seems to do on hig lvl loot.
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